were living in the Quran says do not
change the creation of god that's
ability of happiness do not change the
creation of god that is a command for
the Muslims and it is in the the
imperative form in the Arabic language
do not change the creation of God and it
says in the pond that the devil will
encourage human beings to change the
creation of God and the devil says what
I elated I'm not a lot they will change
the creation of a lot they will alter
the creation of God so the Muslim see
this as a gross transgression and
therefore this type of science which has
been separated from the sacred is
unacceptable from a Muslim perspective
the Muslim sees the scientist as a
believer first and foremost and that
when the scientist is divorced from
belief and from the moral and ethical
boundaries of the Islamic traditions
then the Muslim seeds that scientists as
a transgressor and so there is no doubt
that the Muslims would would say that
science that the Quran encourages such
the Quran many many verses in the Quran
tell us not just to reflect on
theological issues reflect on scientific
issues and in answer to is their science
in our text the Quran has many many
verses directly related to science and
more reasonable tires the french
scientist has a very clearly articulated
in several books that the interesting
things and knows about the Quran is
unlikely at the chair rocks and the New
Testament that the Quranic scientific
statements are consistent with with
modern science and modernize I mean by
their what they have shown us to be true
for instance in the pond it says a ton
young go-getter some Elijah Wood are
haven't they looked at the heavens and
the earth and then it says Kenneth
Ruskin of a second album they were bound
together and we
word which you spoke up an album that
means we exploded then put something in
Arabic is the hernia it's an explosion
of breaking out of boundary and then it
has the government and that equalization
height and then from water we created
every living thing now here is a Quranic
verse that is is very consistent with
the modern theory of the beginning of
creation and what's interesting for the
Muslim is is the big bang theory was
forced upon the sign to the community I
mean there's a lot of people that would
like to say it's kind of Christian
sciences of you know know they had a big
problem with it initially because they
did not want to admit the idea that the
universe was not eternal and in fact
Einstein in his initial general theory
of relativity in his initial equation
what what he discovered was that they
actually indicated an unstable universe
in other words mathematically it either
had to be expanding or contracting and
that bothered him so much that he put
correctors equations in there to make it
stable so that he could say that the
universe would eternal and he later
admitted that that was a mistake because
the scientific evidence did indicate
that in fact the universe's is in stable
the unstable edwin hubble discovered
that the universe in fact is expanding
and the and now which the research was
done right down here in stanford with
the backdrop radiation coming into the
earth which were the effects of the
original explosion of the Big Bang so
the floor on very clearly makes that
statement about the universe and in fact
says well Samantha naina have the eighth
and the heavens we have created with
power were in natomas your own and we
are expanding them quite very clearly in
airplane and we are expanding them in
the the fifth century sixth century
commentator on the Quran who even hacia
he was an Angela theme from Spain said
that this must mean somehow that the
universe is growing now this is I'm is
the 6th century a scholar being forced
to look at the
the language and what are the thing and
to take it literally and he had no
evidence for that now it's interesting
that say Thomas Aquinas in the Middle
Ages said that it is only true police
that we believe it is only through faith
that we believe that the universe had a
beginning because it cannot be proven
and this was the position of the
Catholic Church because the agree father
said no it was eternal so here within
the Quran itself no it tells us that the
universe is created and gives us a very
interesting description of how it
actually took place it also talks about
the Big Crunch which is as the Quran
says very clearly that as we as we have
spread out the universe so me will roll
it up and the also the entropic meltdown
of the universe is described very
clearly in the Quran it says that the
earth in the end of time will boil over
so the water will literally boil over
and that there will be a cheap
everywhere and this is what they called
a great keep down of the universe when
the major of entropy of the pieces is
moving out to a constant state and this
is a heat melt down for the universe
this again is in the pot on the Quran
has very clear descriptions of
embryology in fact that the Prophet
Muhammad was once asked what determines
the male of the female and he said there
is a race between the male of water that
this is his language of the seventh
century the male water and the female
walk and the one that gets there first
and he said quite literally yet the saga
men sir we were not as ever did they
will race by the the water of the mail
in the water flume female and the one of
the surfer will determine what it is now
we know the x and the y chromosome now
the x is the female from the bone to why
is the male coma zone and the one that
gets there first will determine whether
the child is a male or a female the
Prophet Muhammad said when he broke his
back he used to break it on date which
is sugar
photos and he said that Mahama was
tended at her with Tabitha raja oh god
my thirst has been quenched and my veins
have been soaked my veins have been
soaked with nutrients with sugar and you
can do as you do a glucose test on
fasting person at the instant that the
sugar gets to the tongue you can do a
six tests and blood sugar goes up
immediately because there was going to
immediate dispersion of glucose within
the body it's almost instantaneous it's
quite extraordinary the Prophet Mohammed
also we learn in school that Thomas
Harvey discovered the circulation of
blood even the thieves who was aids
preceded him by about six hundred years
talked about the circulation of blood
but we also have a tradition from the
Prophet Mohammed in the chiffon i HED
tiffany as in the jetty at them chiffon
Satan flows in the body of Adam through
the flowing pathways of the blood right
and the the the dominant belief was the
blood with stationary it was not moving
in the body and he clearly articulated
the movement and I could go on because
there really are extraordinary
scientific explanations in the Quran of
many many things and inside keith moore
who is a very well-known embryologist
has written the textbook that is used in
several universities in the united
states when he read about the history of
embryology saying that if there was no
history until the microscope was
discovered as somebody actually in
arabia wrote him a letter saying your
flight roams the Quran mentions very
specific details about embryology keith
moore took it quite seriously and looked
into it and found in fact and he
actually has stated in his most recent
edition of his book on embryology which
is used at the UCLA Medical School that
the qur'anic description of the
embryonic creation of the fetal cells
and the movement
complete fetus is consistent with what
we know in modern embryology and it
would have been impossible for a human
being to have that knowledge in the
seventh century by other than some type
of intuition or interpret divine
inspiration and he said and I have no
other explanation for it so I with that
I think I'll just comes earlier when you
said that the triumph that sort of just
read one on relative really has no
business doing though he transgressed
for instance in the case of the cloning
I think would be a good example with
that jr. some awesome items was a
similar conclusion yet well accepted
that scientists viewed as a form of the
truth and there were how to be
compatible with the truth that expressed
in the labyrinth so what what is is can
truth be wrong because the
transgressions in camberley to 10 of
stuff then it on but it's true they did
it they closed the sheep and and they're
probably going to keep on closing more
sheep work or whatever going with what
they're going to people they want people
it hasn't really that I want you guys
out so uh so if it works then I believe
you would agree to this that there's
some elements
truth there there's something real and
true that it's not safe so so how do you
reconcile them assuming that the truth
is fine but the fact that it goes
against what crash would be perceived as
the truth expressed by Islam well I
acted there's some kind of for me I mean
what you're articulating there's there's
some basic flaw here that I thing is
that for instance it is true that a a
gun is fired into the human heart a 38
caliber will definitely kill that person
but but that doesn't mean that you know
to do it is trip or to do it is in fact
you know the idea that the science that
is enabling people to do these things
might certainly be based on demonstrable
proof and demonstrable truths but that
does not mean that that action the
subsequently result from that knowledge
are true or are are worthy of doing you
see what I mean in other words I think
that you know if we can genetically
altered things if we can genetically
clone things that the knowledge that has
enabled us are empowered us to do that
is a type of truth I mean it's either
true or assault if it's true then then
it will be consistent right with with
what we know and what we're able to do
with it but I don't think that that
knowledge itself is a permission to
transgress boundaries in other words I
might know something to be true in
relations just to cause an effect in the
world but it's true that if I punch
somebody that that creates a certain
effect on that person but the action
itself is divorced from the truth of my
knowledge of what what happens when the
action is done so that you know I think
it's very important to separate the idea
of knowledge itself and the knowledge
that we have and what we do with that
College do you see what I mean I think
you think there's an objective truth
they can call sheet at the fact that
well I don't know he is a back to me is
so amended it that an objective truth
but there's a certain sense is a
different type of truth Michael my
father who this is truth or a hora moral
truth that says whatever the gym with
this knowledge when we did a quick
should be using and everything working
for work this is the point and the
Prophet Muhammad says oh god I ask you
for useful knowledge and I think refuge
in you from harmful knowledge because
truth as we know for verbally is a
double-edged sword it can work for us or
it can work against us and it's very
dangerous because when it's in the hands
of people that really have no moral
grounding and many Sciences don't and I
think a scientist that could develop
napalm does not have a moral grounding
and yet we have research scientists in
this country that work in defense that
work on developing more and more
sophisticated weapons to destroy human
being the Prophet Muhammad forbade us to
kill with fire we cannot kill another
human being with fire it is prohibited
in islam and by analogy the muslim
scholars have said that nuclear bombing
is a type of killing people with fire
and that is impermissible now the
Catholic Church interestingly enough in
the Middle Ages one of the post close a
crossbow was an unethical form of
killing another human being in other
words they did have a concept that you
go something could argue all introduced
me to cross ball its shooting it with an
arrow
you know you're killing the person well
the idea was but that there's some
nobility when when men go out to fight
there is a nobility in how we fight
there was a general in the Pentagon who
when the Iraqi they found out there were
88,000 by their own admittance there
were a thousand soldiers that were
buried alive with bulldozers this
Pentagon the general says there's no
noble way to kill people right well I
was totally disagree i think the samurai
warrior would certainly disagree because
part of their training was to learn the
art of fighting nobly that there is a
way that human beings act within each
other even when we go to war together
and I know that the that the Christian
tradition certainly has a rules that
relate to in their in their cannon of
rules of war that relate to fighting
noses and I know that also the Jewish
tradition has its laws that relate to
war also so I think you know the point
is yes that we do have knowledge and we
can do extraordinary things with that
knowledge but you know where do we go
visit what permission do we have you
know and and I think probably the most
dangerous inquiry for me about genetic
cloning is this we go back to eugenics
this is Hitler I mean this goes back to
who decides what is the deformity and
what you know who decides how we you
know we clean up the gene pool who
decides what what are inferior genes
that we don't want to have out there and
we've got people saying that the black
people are at the the positively skewed
end rather lately skewed end of the bell
curve that they're inferior people
through intelligence well maybe we don't
want into inferior people around you
know maybe we should look at the genes
that make them in fear and we can
those from the gene pool I mean we do
have knowledge but how are we going to
use this knowledge I can't help myself
but think about the noble warrior I'm
gonna start record damn I can't help but
think are the Klingon warp who
apparently is 57 died nobly and every
day is a good day to die see that that
was better that we not fight and have
not been at each other in the first
place I agree they the the issue of
chroming and what is point toward
exactly that we can have a knowledge we
have a probability in science and
technology to do things but should we
should we use this knowledge
neuroscience what does it lead us toward
what kind of people does it make us into
or how is it common with meeting a child
of God be making uniqueness and likeness
of God so the whole issue is a pony is
really a strong ethical and moral
question what do we become we spent in
excess I think that is
compression easily in whatever negative
unforeseen circumstances of using
technology like that such as doing it so
they're just using the questions I think
built in but perhaps in several it's
acknowledged it is true it's what do we
do it is how do we use it should we even
pursue it that's that's the major
question and I think what we need the
issue here can deploy the goal for
justice team from what perhaps would be
considered the Jewish point of view even
though it's such a new field the Jewish
point of view hasn't really been
formulated something that came out
Saturday last week or something like
that though they had time to sit down
and think about what their position is
going to be honest so I'm kind of
talking something to tempt off the top
of my head responsive questions and by
the top contender chronicles of course
of major ethical problem is there's
another factor that they come to the
place in any ethical for reviewers which
is that whatever laws let's say progress
pounces or somatic Sweeney or the
religious communities try to impose on
scientists in a certain sense are not
going to make a bit of difference
because I if America is a go by these
laws which which i think is going to be
a far pretty unlikely unlikely scenario
because you always have a private lab
and don't happen again sir to the
government they can do it
doing anything other countries out there
that have the knowledge America does not
have monopoly on on biological knowledge
so comes the discovery building in the
government so who live in seconds
dollars per cent Regus holding office if
anybody's guess he probably lived in
America but there you go it's got them
and the nominees comes out there they're
capable of doing the better language in
the original articles of the cloning
thing came in indy nature magazine was
essentially problem almost like a recipe
for how to do it and then anybody out
there you got the right equipment is I
think it's redic ripples will be quite
expensive but if you have right
equipment that you could do it yourself
start calling cheese and then know how
much Japan and who knows what's next I
think we all know what receptors after
chimpanzee so the ethical problems that
anybody might bring up that we should do
this and we should Suzanne in the
servants are irrelevant in the sense
then they're going to do it anymore let
me out there no matter what laws and
come up with what regulations to come up
with would invite you come on somebody
else is going to do it so reminder is
the real issue that the ethical
community is the politically testament
is how harbans want to deal with this
thing in the worst-case scenario because
it's going to happen the eugenics of the
problem of eugenics is going to happen
out there is I don't know one year
whatever it is when you can play the
border what types of child you want for
it and then everybody seems to be
streamlined a lot of certain lines of
festive expertise how this is the world
and just really going going to deal with
them are we going to learn live with it
are we going to go somehow ionizers
where those delivered to get away design
what are whatever give you assistance I
be in I believe the Jewish you on this
would be the kids as from like a reality
it's there in the same sense that the
nuclear power and nuclear bombs are
there and we haven't learned in some
capacity areas and to use them to the
cross manner and that's whatever laws he
plays on them are not going to matter to
the person next door who does mobilize
the laws that I'm like most internet
leaders of an example Judaism's of
tampering with things that we shouldn't
cameras it's the case of work done on TV
bro has colitis which means the mixture
of certain types of peace where you
can't plant a great line so close to a
vegetable or something like that you
can't make certain things that should be
mixed together so its provision of
course where you can't plant a great
line so close to a vegetable or
something like that you can't make
certain things that should be fixed
together so its provision of course we
really should get into we really should
not be cameras in kind of stuff but once
it's out there and one of the rest of
the world is using it we also really
also have to learn to use it in ways
that might be advantageous for them
disregard to the clone how and the
question would come up okay we've done
it this long a person suppose I do
indeed the secret of the question for
the religious community vengeance how do
we treat Clark you can be and then how
do we then exert influence and forth in
the comes in the community about how we
treat that as a as a person and not as
though something for spare parts or have
some somehow less than human so I agree
is that one these things are done in an
emergency situation even though you
didn't you and you would not want to be
involved in the activity what is done
the palace is there you're on a dif
different puzzle and way to make people
and I think that the religious person
always with intention with his culture
with the world the general world around
them that does not share their
resistance and particularly maybe in
science service some to some degree has
been outside religious faith I think you
know with this issue again going back to
the way the Muslims would look at it is
that everything any newly introduced
thing into the cultural news has to be
looked at from the perspective of two
things one is benefit and the others
arms because this the police is that the
Islamic law the sake of all of Islam is
absolutely there for the benefit
human beings it is for no other purpose
and this is by consensus of Muslim
scholars that every law and injunction
that God has given us he has given us
that law for our own benefit and any
prohibition he is prohibited it's
because there's harm in it now for
instance is to give an example warning
in the product clearly says in wine is
benefit for people but enid is harm and
its arm is greater than its benefit so
avoid it very simple clear so we have
sizes now that tell us you know it's
good have a glass of wine every night
you know it actually lower your blood
pressure it'll prevent a cardiac black
and build up and you'll have lower
higher HDL and and and give us all the
scientific explanation well you know
you're also gonna have a lot of people
that have cirrhosis of the liver and are
going to become alcoholics and you're
going to have tens of thousands of
people die on the highways because of
drunk drivers you're going to have lives
that are ruined you're going to have a
child abuse you're going to have
pregnant problems with women now we know
just one little drink can I can possibly
harm the fetus of a child so again the
Quran would say yes that there is
benefit in life but there is great harm
now the cloning of sheep and Scotland
even casual cashmere sweaters might
become very cheap you know n and I
happen to like cashmere sweater but I
can't afford them right so yeah that
that's beneficial I'm not going to the
you know the cashmere it's harmful for
that right there going to be a little
ticked off if they get to me he's got a
shoots up there being cloned right in
fact the Scottish Kashmir Wobs might you
know a chance to stop the process from
the beginning but again what is the harm
of this and part of the harm I mean a
good example good is there as it's very
curious attempts at developing a
oil-eating yer
micro to clean up oil spills this is a
very serious attempt by scientists and
what their I've use that when there's an
oil spill we introduce the bacteria into
the area and boom they'll eat up all the
oil well what do they eat up after they
finished with the oil spill right
another example is the the killer bee a
lot of people don't know that the killer
bees was actually an experiment that
that got out of hand down in South
America where perhaps they don't have as
stringent laboratory conditions that
they do in the Silicon Valley right and
these got out of a cross there was a
scientist literally crossing African
bees with with Brazilian bees and some
of them got away and now we've got a
killer bee problem which is actually
quite serious and a lot of people are
unaware of this another good example is
the the wise grows widespread use of
antibiotics in this country it's just a
phenomenal we're having microbial
changes going on in in the india in the
bacterial world that are phenomenal in
relation to their impact on the human
beings we have harmless now is actuated
it was completely harmless in the 1940s
they are causing most of the Nova camiel
deaths in hospitals like pseudomonas
which is a bacteria that in the nineteen
forty was innocuous was completely
harmless back here but it has mutated
because of widespread use of penicillin
to the point where it's killing
thousands of people every year so again
we have a human being that according to
the Quran one that will teach them in an
end the end of Aviva you have given aids
been given a very small amount of
knowledge and yet we have the human
beings that is the hubris and wonderful
Greek tragedies right it's always hubris
that destroys the human being in Greek
tragedies and this is what human beings
have we have become so arrogant in in
what we're doing in the world that we
think that we can literally do whatever
we want with impunity without any fear
of the repercussions of that and
scientists
who in many cases are deeply egotistical
people that are really in search of the
nobel prize of fame and glory and will
follow venues that will take them to so
we don't have the humble pie of
individual who is seeking to understand
the creation of God we have an
individual that literally wants to play
God in his laboratory by creating a new
form of life now the Quran very clearly
says in the Medina says the tournament
do need F believe a lot of the four eva
the nasty method estenio devil an
analogy has been struck for you human
being so listen up it says literally
listen attentively surely though you
call upon beside God they cannot create
a fly even if all of them came together
to do it and if any life was taken from
that fly they could not return that life
to the plot how weak is the speaker and
the salt you see now this very clearly
report on that there is some human
impulse in mankind to walk to the
permission right the Promethean nature
of man I'm going to oppose God I mean
permitted sacrifice his livers being
eaten out and and Zeus strap him to a
rock to suffer for giving knowledge to
mankind any boasting I want mankind to
rebel against the gods and this again is
this satanic little character who comes
in he's the Whisperer and he's the
Whisperer go ahead do it you can do it
you see in the model role people ask why
should we do it because it's doable you
see this as if this is some kind of
ethical justification no we can do it
why find the mountain to prove that we
can do it wycombe the sheet to show that
we can do it or the Quran says that when
the earth brings forth all of its riches
and it becomes ornamented like the sky
has become ornamented and which is
interesting because satellite pictures
now show the earth looks literally like
a
because of the sky and it says well run
the I hoo-ha unknown club you know Nadia
and the inhabitants of the earth think
that they're all powerful over it they
think they finally conquered nature and
this again is part of this Greek
sickness that used nature as
antagonistic to the human being because
they believed that nature was they were
embodiment of divine energies that were
antagonistic with man the Quranic
worldview is that Sahara diplomatic son
Elijah Wood of God has subjugated for
you everything that's in the heavens in
the earth it is at your disposal the
Quran says that was that he that he has
placed everything in the earth for your
benefit and if for your benefit
including the cove of snakes which can
kill us but it's there because it's
there something there's a wisdom that
there's a fellow as Aristotle would
habits there's there the purpose in that
creation and everything has purpose and
so our goal is to be humble before God
and before God's creation the Quran says
that the service of God are those who
tread lightly on the earth a bad Barack
men are living in turn out of Oklahoma
they tread lightly on the earth what a
beautiful description treading lightly
on your help grossly we're treading on
the earth today literally we're setting
on it with bulldozers and with bombs and
with dynamite we have no reverence for
our own mother the Prophet Mohammed said
be vigilant about this earth because
she's your mother and just as the mother
has life of piety sort of the earth has
right society you know so I just think
that we're really in a dangerous
predicament and I don't fully accept
these ideas are going to do it anyway
and this is for me this is you know we
can say you know that well genocide is
part of the human conditions are always
going to do it
there is no reason why there should be
genocide and when the Islamic law is
being implemented in the world you will
not find any historical records of
Muslims committing genocide against some
other people you will not find it
historically on the wreck i guarantee
you and people will say what about the
church in armenia the church in armenia
were the young turks and they were very
very distant from islamic takers law by
that time the muslims have always and
it's not because we're ontological e
better than people it's not because we
have some special scatters that were
chosen about other people no it's
because we literally have parameters
with which God has commanded us to stay
and a vibrant in and if we abide within
them we are protected when we transgress
them the four answers don't blame
anybody but yourself when when calamity
striking let us not go pink scientists
to directly it so that that religious
person is a patrolman versus be a
scientist or even to be a doctor
certainly as you say science can be is
the hood or pieces and and much of a
testing acting forward and I would not
want I'm not doing that I'm not going
ever again I'm not completely convinced
of that as much I mean this is the
arguments it's time to put forward and
the argument size of support is that
religion is bad for people because it's
left up in a superstitious state and
many scientists are deeply devoted to
the destruction of religion in fact the
man talkin to the various well known
evolutionist just recently he was
awarded the humanist of the Year award
and in his acceptance speech said you
know people create organizations to
destroy the virus aids because it's so
dangerous and he said what we need is an
organization to destroy the virus of
station because this is the most
dangerous thing that is confronting the
human animal
right and I think there are a lot of
scientists the truly believe that the
religion needs to that you know we were
in the magic apparently ball to the
religious stage and now we're on the
rational scientific stage and we need to
just do away with all of this hogwash
really get rid of it it has no relatives
just holding people up and it's
superstition and this is in no way I
mean the scientists are honored in the
Islamic traditions I'm in no way
intimating that Sciences is not
something no the doctors one of our
greatest theologians among chef they
said that really knowledge is reduced to
two things knowledge of God and
knowledge of medicine because one
benefits the soul and the other benefits
the body and man is nothing other than
body and soul it's a beautiful
articulation of that so doctors have
always been honored as scientists that
enhanced human life should be honored
but scientists that degrade human life I
have no place in my heart for respect or
dignity for them
it has been a extremely big topic within
few generations since Darwin came up to
experience specifically the last about
30 years ago here is my five by and
large most Orthodox Jews will take a
position of all hardly rejecting
Darwin's theory of evolution because it
comes into such blatant conflict with
tutorials so the viewpoint that i'm
going to put forth is not necessarily
that of the bulk of the jewish scholars
out there it's my own viewpoint and i
would label it a minority viewpoint
within orthodox judaism dad Darwin came
up with a theory that species involved
they evolved to almost confidence and
certain genetic elements get in there
like that place among humans into the
whole thing and after billions of years
or so as a new species is form so Darwin
I don't recall vision creatures came up
in the periodic system one sort of God
roses or something like that