finding time so I read a book that was
written in the 14th century by a
Palestinian scholar called the virtues
of plagues and epidemics and it was all
about the blessings that come with these
grave tribulations and one of our great
scholars said it's important in every
tribulation to see three blessings it
could be worse it's in your worldly
matters and not your other worldly
matters and it's this in this life and
not in the next life and that's reason
to be grateful hmm well I have to agree
with much of that has been said I think
maybe one thing that I can add from the
Jewish tradition but
hardly unique to it is seeing this time
of trouble as a call to repentance which
is a extremely important Jewish value at
all times
Maimonides borrow a contemporary phrase
said that we should never let a crisis
go to waste in agreeing of course that
we don't know why or even though we
don't know why or especially because we
don't know why we have to take every
crisis as a call it's repentance a
crisis in olden times supposed to be met
with the blowing of the shofar of
trumpets which is also something we do
during the High Holidays a season of
repentance I remember when I did a gap
year of intensive religious study
between high school and college and my
rabbi teacher was also the school medic
and one of the things that he was a
stern man I guess one of the things he
was famous for was if you went in with a
medical problem his first response was
repent and then after that you know he
might go into the medical issue itself
there was a cartoon in The New Yorker
just a few weeks ago actually I mean it
was it was a cartoon of Mike Pence
standing in front of a podium with the
seal when everything like that it's Mike
Pence speaking to the audience saying
and the best protection in this time is
washing your hands and repentance you
know we live in a country now where you
know for half the country that's a punch
line but the other half of the country
it's an absolute truth and I saw I think
that one thing that Judaism would
certainly counsel and this time is even
though we don't know why why this is
occurring even though we have less of an
emphasis than Christianity does on
redemptive suffering that's certainly
the suffering that we experience or that
we see others experience it's supposed
to be a call for for us to repent to
mend our own ways and that's both in our
relationship to God and relationship to
our fellow human beings Danielle I think
that is such a powerful and important
point I would never be as bold as
Lincoln in identifying any human
catastrophe whether it's the Civil War
even the Holocaust earthquakes tsunamis
viral pandemics I would never say
this or that particular one is a
punishment but one needn't say that to
recognize the great truth that you just
propounded from the Jewish tradition
they should always be reminders of the
importance of repentance we do fall
short even the best of us human beings
even the best cultures even the best
nations even the most virtuous are not
perfect we fall short of God's standards
in the Christian tradition we refer to
that as original sin but all traditions
have this notion of human imperfection
of falling short and where we fall short
we need and Lincoln again pointed out
that that's not just something for
individuals though it's very important
for individuals to repent it's even true
for nations so during the Civil War he
asked the people to observe a day of
humiliation I believe it was April 30th
1863 that he asked people to to respect
a day of prayer and fasting and
humiliation humbling ourselves
humiliation in the sense of humbling
ourselves and asking God's forgiveness
he had in mind of course particularly
the sin of slavery but anytime like life
is lost I think it seems to be one thing
we should be thinking about and
repenting for is our own carelessness
with human life to what extent have we
as a culture or as individuals failed in
respect of honoring the profound
inherent and equal dignity of each human
life of each human being of each member
of the human family it's never out of
season to be raising that question and
repenting for wherever we have fallen
short and we do all fall short so I
think you've really brought to us from
the Jewish tradition of powerful point
yeah I think I would add to and it goes
back to Hebrew Scripture Libra ham
having the audacity to question God that
there is a space and there is a
tradition in the legacies of Jerusalem
um Judaism and Christianity and Islam of
being angry at God questioning God I
wonder
why in the world could this kind of
suffering become so massive and we look
at just a history of a species you see
not just plays but you've seen the
various you know massive attacks and
massacres and catastrophes and Holocaust
and slavery and we'd go on and on and on
and so I think there's nothing wrong
with acknowledge especially myself as
just Christian buddy a Christian who
comes out of the left wing of the
Reformation so it's both a Protestant
but a particular kind of Protestant of
course bayless Bastard like myself so
I'm just collecting my Baptist identity
for a second year I where do my God my
God why hast thou forsaken me that even
Jesus Jesus itself the fresh avocation
of God it's willing to raise that kind
of question but raising that question in
such a way that it feel linked to a
righteous indignation it's not just a
raw rage there's a spiritual content to
the anger and the questioning so it's
Socratic in some sense because it's it
is raising the most unsettling question
but it is prophetic because at the
center of it is this deep sensitivity
hyper sensitivity to the suffering and
what are we going to do about it
and as brother Ravi says uh you know
what was in place so that we question
God we question ourselves our own greed
our own indifference our own callousness
we question our society how come we were
not more prepared to deal with this kind
of massive suffering as it relates to
our healthcare system and so forth as a
relates to the distributions of power
and resources and wealth in the society
all of these are ways in which is both
humility and tenacity it is an
acknowledgment of a call for repentance
but also a call for very intense witness
do all that we can to minimize the
suffering in place yeah you know the
great the great scripture scholar the
great New Testament scholar NT Wright
Tom Wright had a piece up either
yesterday or today I saw it this morning
in which he began by pointing out that
we just can't know and therefore we
should never claim that the sand so
plague or war catastrophe as a divine
chastisement or divine punishment but he
said what this catastrophe this pandemic
like other great causes of suffering
should provoke in us is the tradition
and now he's going back to what
Christians call the Old Testament to the
Hebrew Scripture the tradition of
lamentation lamentation it's not wrong
to lament to cry out to God as Jesus
does from the cross from the cross in
that passage that Cornell was quoting
Jesus on Jesus himself was quoting the
opening to one of the Psalms Danielle
you will recognize that Loa Loa lama
sabachthani my God my God why have you
forsaken me but of course what jesus'
listeners his jewish listeners in any
event those who heard him who knew the
psalm would have known was the rest of
the psalm so it begins my god my god why
have you forsaken me llama
lolol lama sabachthani but then it goes
on and gradually builds hopefulness and
it the psalm concludes with an
affirmation that God is in charge and
that God can be trusted and that
ultimately God will bring about my
Redemption so when Jesus's hearers
Jewish hearers heard those words heard
that Psalm they knew that it was the
opening cry of despair that ends in the
affirmation of hope and I think that is
something that is a model for us yes
lemonade cry out into our despair but
never forget at the end of the day God
is in charge we need to place our trust
in him that's a really good point
because that was it not I don't disagree
of course we found with brother Wes that
I have this idea of Abraham challenging
God is something very deep in the Jewish
tradition and calling out but whether it
says something more theological the more
sociological reporting from on the
ground in the Jewish community certainly
there has been much less of the anger at
God and the righteous indignation and
much more of the message this needs to
be a reminder of trusting in God I think
one of the most one of my favorite
things that I read from a rabbi during
this crisis is a rabbi well of course
it's a longer message but to distill it
down to one line he said we shouldn't
think of this crisis as placing us in
radical uncertainty and I know of course
we all feel that and we have a lot of
anxiety over that but it's actually
unveiling the uncertainty that's always
a part of our life being the radical
uncertainty of every day and the radical
dependence we have on every day and so
while there's certainly a place to
wonder at the suffering and question the
suffering but what we're seeing now on
the ground in the Jewish community at
least the ones that I'm a part of is
really a message of as this crisis as an
impetus to redouble our trust in God and
to recognize that the the deep anxiety
uncertainty uncertainty we feel now is
actually something we should carry with
us all the time so that were constantly
reminded of how deeply we depends on God
for it for every moment for every breath
for every beat of our heart and so I
think from from the Islamic tradition
it's probably closer to the book of Joe
which is a good book to read for people
these days because Joe was a good and
righteous man and yet God tested him
because the the challenge was that he
was only good and righteous because he
had all these blessings so if the
blessings are taken away then let's see
how he behaved and and Joe and this is
one of the the purposes that my
tradition gives for tribulation is that
it's for you to see who you are and to
reveal yourself during those times
one of the most important things I think
that Rabi talked about was that was
humility that this should be a time and
this one of the purposes of suffering is
that it engenders and it activates these
virtues within us and one of them is
virtue of vulnerability and how we
respond to that by being humbled and and
recognizing that Helen Keller said that
the world is indeed filled with
suffering but we can never forget that
it's also filled with the overcoming of
suffering and so that's one of the
things that we're seeing that they said
there's an unprecedented coalition of
doctors all over the world working
together which is amazing and and I
think one of the things about these
situations is that you really see the
best and sometimes the worst of humanity
but you know people talk about the
social isolation but there's actually a
lot of connectedness that's happening
now people are calling people they
haven't called in a long time and
checking on how people are who have
elderly neighbors I've been called
several times because now I'm elderly I
guess but people called me I'm asking
you know you're one of our elders do you
need any help do you need I think that's
one of the the benefits of times like
these and so that's a good point we were
physically required to be more distant
from each other but that also provides
an opportunity for us to be spiritually
closer to each other and at a time of
such harsh polarization when citizens
are not treating each other as fellow
citizens but as enemies because of their
political disagreements maybe it's not a
bad thing God always brings good out of
evil maybe a good that will come out of
this is a little more spiritual
closeness even across the lines of
political or ideological division people
will recognize each other's humanity
feel that bond of kinship that comes
from being fellow members of this of
this species fellow human beings those
of us and our traditions of course
recognize all of us as God's family in
the Jewish and Christian traditions we
have the idea of man being made in the
very image and likeness of God and that
there's no more profound common bond
than that so why can't we at least be
gracious to each other decent toward
each other maybe
this will be an occasion when some of us
will become a bit more generous toward
each other both in terms of what we
normally think of as generosity
philanthropy but also more generous in
understanding each other being willing
to listen to each other not read
somebody out of the out of the human
race because they happen to disagree
with us about politics or or philosophy
or religion or anything else it's a
great point I'd love to hear other
people's thoughts as well isolation is
its own form of suffering and of course
one of the things that has been most
difficult about this crisis is that
we've had to physically distance
ourselves from each other so in addition
to some of Robby's suggestions how can
we pursue spiritual connection in
isolation
mystics love nothing more than isolation
we have an entire edition of anchorites
who actually left the world in order to
be more contemplative and and we have
wonderful stories of the Church Fathers
Thomas Merton talks about these church
fathers out in caves in Egypt that fled
the world one of the in our tradition
the Prophet Muhammad said towards the
latter days cling to your homes because
there would be so much found us and one
of the things that I've noted here is
the air has just cleared up wonderfully
and it's it's quite stunning we've had
rain since the quarantine started we
haven't had rain for months and we just
got all this rain and the first day of
the quartet I went out and saw the most
extraordinary double rainbow that I've
ever seen and I just felt expanded by
that experience of just hope so I think
there's a lot of blessings that will
come out of this I have the same
concerns that everybody else does I
think there are people that are
suffering the people that don't have the
the wherewithal to afford a week out of
work let alone two months three months
so I mean that's undeniably a very
serious consideration
just a little brother Robbie mentioned
this notion of lament that I just want
to touch on briefly because I think it
feeds into the kind of concern to sister
sharee is pushing us on because the man
a very different analogy the myth really
provides no consolation or redemption
you know their early essays the book of
Gershom Scholem and Walter Benjamin
Becker just have a have a graduate
student Sarah Corrigan's write the
magnificent dissertation on lamentations
readings of the book of lamentations and
how that's worked through the harding to
shakespeare's and the others so the
lament going back to hebrew scripture
again in some ways linked the wisdom
literature Ecclesiastes there's his
naked moment in which God seems to be so
thoroughly absent
soap in which it looks as if we have to
lead candidly acknowledge the degree to
which the possibilities of consolation
and redemption are held at arm's length
you remember that wonderful moment and
gesture till he talks about how
Christians actually have a God who
hasn't experienced this atheism for VOC
because God is the king and a rebel at
the same time back against the wall
fighting God calling God in the question
and so forth we think that dimension is
something that has to go hand-in-hand
with what I think brother Robbie and
brother Ham son and brother Daniel were
talking about position read that our
engagement in the service in the love in
the mercy even in the trust is always
over against this profound grimness and
and so that even even st. francis of
assisi a Chester Chesterton says he was
able to be such a good aesthetic because
he loves so intensely so his isolation
will goes hand in hand with this
profound sensitivity to the suffering of
creatures human beings and others and
we're in a situation where I
our isolations not chosen the way it was
was a Francis or the months in some is
forced and we're in a moment of such
spiritual decaying wall deterioration
with the greed and the indifference and
corruption simply running a but
everywhere we look throughout our
institution to our everyday life from
the White House to the the tooth to Town
Hall to the black in the corner so that
the rimless becomes even more intense
and hence the need for more
fortification which is spiritual and
moral you know Cornell I I think this
crisis like all great crises in history
is also going to show us true human
heroism and even absolute absolutely
holiness I read a story today we're
already trained it would say that among
fellow citizens about bouncing back in
wonderful ways and save us screwing
around the world but know already and
I'm Sonia well I heard a story today
about an elderly woman not here in the
United States elsewhere who is in need
of a ventilator because of the kovat 19
a virus for breathing but she declined
it in order that it not be withheld from
a younger person so that the younger
person who had not of course yet lived a
full life as the older woman had would
have an opportunity of life now I say
this as a firm supporter of the idea
that there must be no discrimination
including age based or disability-based
discrimination in health care allocation
even though we have shortages so I do
not want the government or the health
care system to discriminate on the basis
of age or on the basis of disability and
I think there's going to be a lot of
temptation to do that to involve
ourselves in that kind of invidious
discrimination I worry about our
cognitively or physically disabled two
brothers and sisters people with Down
syndrome or with addictions or with
bipolar disease
not in being given equal treatment and
fair treatment in the allocation of
resources but laying that issue aside as
important as it is I just want to point
to that one little act of heroism or
self-sacrifice real christ-like
self-sacrifice on the part of somebody
who turned down a ventilator so that
someone else could have it my dear
friend Mariana Orlandi who is an Italian
visiting fellow at the Madison program
here at Princeton told me that already
65 or 70 Catholic priests and Italy have
themselves died of kovat 19 priests who
were ministering to people who were
desperately ill with with the disease
again christ-like self-sacrifice
carrying out their vocation their
service their mission to others and
giving their their own lives and we of
course are deeply saddened by this loss
of life at the same time we cannot but
be inspired by the courage and by the
heroism and by the willingness to deny
and even sacrifice self for the sake of
of others just on your question of
isolation specifically and I think two
points that are worth making one is if I
think we've all been quoting from the
Catholic Church at some point tonight so
I'll add to theirs there's a pretty
recent book by Robert Cardinal Sarathy
a very famous African Cardinal about the
power of silence it's the subtitle
something like against the Cato ship of
noise and of course I mean we need to
reach out to and be compassionate to
people in isolation people who are
suffering from the psychological effects
of quarantine but for those of us who
are healthy and with resources I think
it's worth taking the opportunity for us
to reflect on how silence can be a good
thing
Hasan's can be a blessing a cardinal
sauernotes
in the book you know that we learn in
the Hebrew prophets that our God is not
in the fund or the earthquake right but
in the still small voice and you know we
in an age in which no one can even go to
the gym or take a job without earbuds
but whether we're just afraid if our
thoughts oh we're just afraid to be
alone I think it's I think I think we
can take this opportunity as others were
saying before as a blessing in disguise
that the opportunity to rediscover the
benefits I like actually you subset of
in the mystic tradition of how great
that can be and as a counterpoint to
that though not in contradiction in any
way it's interesting that a requirement
to be silent and a requirement or to be
separate and a requirement to distance
from each other is actually we
establishing human connections of the
great Jewish humanists one of the great
Jewish teachers in this country Leon
Kass who taught at University of Chicago
for many decades I just said to me the
other day that one effect pc's here our
hopes for here has seen it a little bit
is the the rehumanize
our public space and that you know and
depending on where you live in the
country admittedly but you can walk down
the street and no one will make eye
contact no acknowledge each other and
now you can have two people pass by and
the wearing masks and they'll be wearing
gloves and someone will be you know
walking out of their way to keep 6 feet
apart and yet they'll make eye contact
or maybe if there's no masks you'll see
a smile or something like that because
there's something of the sense that
we're all in it together and I think we
can all hope for in a world in which we
all have iPods either or our air buds
either because we're afraid of our own
thoughts or because we don't want to
interact with other people this
situation may be something where the
isolation can actually help us rebuild
human connections thanks Danielle I'd
love to ask you all about trust and that
Trust is vital for leadership in really
any realm whether it's religious
political or organizational and by many
measures many faith communities have
lost credibility and Trust in recent
years for a whole variety of reasons I
wanted to ask you what you saw as the
opportunities for the restoration of
trust through our response as members of
a community of faith to this pandemic
well the you know in the Quran it says
that the human being was created in a
state of anxiety and we see that with
the child when it first comes in the
world it was in the nice womb everything
was wonderful nice temperature the food
was coming in and suddenly it's in this
terrifying place but then the breast
comes and the child's at peace and one
of the things that that I used to do
with my children I have five boys but I
used to throw them up in the air and and
they would love it until it got to the
point where gravity came in and they and
they and they well it was always acting
on but the point when they right before
they came down they would suddenly be in
this complete panic then when they saw
they were coming back to me they they
they kind of suddenly became happy and
cheerful again and and times like these
are those moments of panic where you
have to remind yourself that we're in
good hands and and that is trust in God
and I think for people of faith this is
really our practice and I know Robby and
and and dr. Cornell I'm sure the rabbi
people that practice their faith every
day that's the exercise for times like
these just like an athlete exercises for
the competition these are the times when
when our faith is tested and and that's
why the preparation is so important and
so for people who who don't have a
practice I think these can become very
very difficult times but trusting God
it's every day we our prophet said if
you wake up in the morning don't expect
to see the evening and if you go to
sleep at night don't expect to see the
morning because we're all in a state of
uncertainty and and and the point the
readiness is Hamlet said is all the
point is is to be vigilant and be be
aware that life is temporal and it's
very fragile and we have to really
appreciate it while we have it be
grateful for it and honor it and honor
it in others I mean my own tradition
always talked about by your fruits you
shall know them
and fruits of love have to do with joy
it has to do with kindness and sweetness
it has to do with service to the weak
and vulnerable and so one of the reasons
why so many have lost trust in
leadership political leadership economic
leadership in this case we'll talk about
religious leadership is because when
they look at the fruit they see too much
obsession with worldly success too much
obsession with status can with up
session with money to what accommodation
to do unjust status close and so the
hunger for love the hunger for justice
remained unfulfilled
so we people end up pressing with
spiritual malnutrition and in a moment
in which we can now at our best prove
ourselves by our fault
and say look there are in fact Jews
Muslims Catholics Protestants we can say
the same thing about Buddhists and
Confucian followers and Hindus at their
best and so forth who are concerned
about something other than the dominant
ways of the world and whether we need
this challenge of course is still an
open question but it becomes an occasion
for us to actually show these genuine
fruits of our trusting God our love of
justice are concerned about mercy our
willingness to acknowledge when we're
wrong and most importantly the way in
which we can fuse forms of solidarity
rooted in a love that it's bigger than
each and every one of you know cornellà
and I professor West and I teach
together and it's a great blessing
certainly in my life our teaching
together has been such a wonder if my
life - my life - but but you know
teaching at Harvard and at Princeton we
have an opportunity to teach
extraordinary students that are so
gifted so brilliant so accomplished and
they're great kids they really are good
kids but I would say in Cornell you can
tell me whether the strikes you
correct based on your experience
certainly my experience is perhaps the
most important thing we do is to teach
them to question what they are placing
the emphasis on the in their lives on at
the moment they've got bright futures
ahead of them the world is their oyster
so very often they are focused on what
David Brooks calls the CV values the
curriculum vitae values academic success
good grades a career prospect perhaps
going on to Goldman Sachs or Morgan
Stanley getting going on to Harvard Law
School and to cravats Wayne and more the
status the prestige that comes with that
of course the money the compensation
that that comes with that now as brother
less than I say to students those things
are not bad we're not asking you to
throw them away
in fact Harvard and Princeton in places
like that rather depend on your going
out and being very successful and making
a lot of money and giving a percentage
of it back to prints that are Harvard
and yet those we need to remind our
students we do remind our students I
think the most important thing we do
really is remind them those CV values
are secondary they matter but they don't
ultimately matter the things that matter
more our faith family virtue solidarity
with others compassion what David Brooks
calls the I believe I remember calling
him correctly tombstone virtues uh and
it's not too early even as a 19 year old
or 23 year old it's not too early to be
thinking as you proceed through life and
making your judgments about what you're
gonna do in life and where you're gonna
place the emphasis in life it's not too
early even at those tender ages to be
thinking what against the horizon of my
death which will come sooner rather than
later life on Earth is short
but in light of that horizon should I
consider important and I think if we get
people focused on that on the tombstone
virtues ultimately what matters then
they will see that it's not so much
money it's not so much power it's not so
much influence or prestige status it is
faith it is family
it is solidarity with those or others it
is friendship
it is compassion it is reaching out to
those who are in need it's serving those
are what really matter before we turn to
audience questions I want to ask each of
you about love one of the callings of
the believer is to embody and to reflect
the love of God for his creation for our
neighbors what opportunities do you see
from your own faith perspective and
embodying that loved to our neighbors at
this time well we could certainly see in
my community just an unbelievable
outpouring of what we call cresset or
loving kindness we're supposed to
supposed to mimic the loving kindness
that God displays to us an outpouring of
love to our fellow neighbors there's a
there's a website I think it's I'm not
advertising on it but I think it's
Corona I said that went up right away
which allowed people in a lot of New
York metro area communities you go there
and they they click on a link that puts
them in a whatsapp group but it's
pairing people who have needs that
people can meet the needs and the the
speed with which the community has
snapped into action with Passover coming
which adds a whole other level of need
on top of ordinarily it's just
remarkable but I do also want to mention
that in the context of what chef Youssef
said a few moments ago about the way our
kind of our everyday religious lives I
don't get the way you said it just right
but our everyday religious lives are
training for moments like these I think
one of the things we've seen which is
obvious and obvious in any crisis is
that you don't build community in the
crisis that you need that religious
communities and all your communities
need to think about the importance
nations local communities a building
community all along I mean it is true
that people are called
- they're better angels in times of
crisis people step outside of themselves
and do extraordinary things but to
really meet the day-to-day needs of
everyone to make sure people are our
housed and fed and clothed and taken
care of just in all the ways all the
ways you don't even think of until the
crisis hits it's really important that
there be very strong communities in
place myself as a as an Orthodox Jew
we're blessed to have something
Catholics had a long time ago before
parishes went suburban but we all
because we can't drive on the Sabbath we
all have to live within walking distance
on the synagogue which means I'm that I
and my fellow congregants all live
within walking distance of each other
now don't do a lot of good now and we
can't you know can't go over to each
other's houses like this but it does
mean that so many people are close at
hand you know to check on neighbors and
to help check on neighbors remotely and
to help them you know dropping packages
at the door or whatever it is and just
you know that's that's the kind of thing
that is a blessing because of our
Sabbath but more broadly the very very
close knit community that we live in
also means that in times of crisis thank
God people are are already so well
connected and really have a spirit of
giving on that that's extremely
beneficial you know building on what the
daniel said doing moving toward
spiritual giant like Rabbi Abraham
Joshua Heschel that the charity and the
philanthropy that we are seeing is a
marvelous thing but it's not the same as
the relation of HESA to the justice that
amos talks about and it seems to me part
of the genius of scripture and this is
from which we Christians and Muslims
flow is this notion of acknowledging how
cat