when Munez ER and debating felon
McCallum I hadn't been islami yakky
Bhushan in Halawa he so nobody that was
just talked to about Islam that had any
brains except that he would embrace
Islam after that what a defeat a nica's
entertain in those two years more people
became Muslim than in the previous 19
it's amazing so you know and then what
time is it okay I'm going to stop there
and maybe we'll finish this another day
yeah so I'll just leave some questions
because I have an interview that I have
to go to but if anybody has any
questions feel free to ask or comments
some may come relative item so at the
very beginning you mentioned that the
prophets of the laws are some told us
that Islam would only exist as a polity
for 30 years but and I'm wondering
whether that is a statement that you'd
recommend to us as like explaining to
people when they either look at things
in Islamic history or governments that
call themselves Islamic and are doing
things that are not following the Sunnah
of the Prophet awesome do you think that
that's something that non-muslims could
hear and understand and and give them a
little bit more wisdom as to how to
understand what's happening I mean I you
know I don't I don't know what people
are how people react there are so many
variables when you talk
to people background education I mean
the word in Arabic 450 laughs difference
of opinion is the word it's it's derived
from a word that has to do with
background califo what you leave behind
so he'll via is your background so he
laps come from different backgrounds you
know we're in you know Black History
Month I mean there's all these people in
America white people that say things
like you know why can't blacks just get
over it but they never define it like
500 years being stripped of your of your
heritage of your history of your name
being you know subjugated being treated
like animals they were actually
categorized as like livestock you know
and that went on until you know 1865 or
1863 with the Emancipation Proclamation
but it takes a hundred years to
legislate civil rights from that and
we're still not there we we don't have
an african-american as president there's
African Americans first lady if we have
a Kenyan American as president he's not
African American he's the East African
right from the Luo tribe to which in
Kenya he couldn't even get elected which
is pretty amazing right that's what
happened to his father his father went
back to Kenya he
there was no upward mobility because of
his tribal background that's part of the
problem in the in the Muslim world and
in Africa as well is that you know
families determined so much there's no
upward mobility there's no meritocracy I
mean the first thing a Syrian asks you
you know Bates mean which house are you
from and right when you tell them boom
you've been identified you know you're
either from a good family or from
another type of family and it doesn't
allow for upward mobility it doesn't
allow for meritocracy the Prophet tried
to eliminate all that stuff judge people
according to the content of their
character not according to their tribe
clan family wealth or lineage
that's how people should be judged so I
don't know you know I mean we have to
embrace the dark you know we have a
shadow in our religion there's every
religion you know dr. winter says that
the history of our religion is the
history of its ego and we tend to forget
that that there's there's a lot of
darkness in our history there's a lot of
beautiful things and in many ways in
terms of the pre-modern rug Muslims have
nothing to be ashamed of it's quite
stunning what they were able to
accomplish given the prevailing
attitudes in most parts of the world
many of the things that the Prophet
taught were the dreams of philosophers
and and they became common coin the
Muslims have always had racism but
they've never had a racism that
prevented somebody from eating with
another person they never had that type
of racism there's no history where they
would not put their hand in a plate that
had a white hand or a black hand in it I
mean they just didn't have that type of
racism so but we have a lot of dark
things in our history in our past and
and our religion our tradition has a lot
of horrible things that they're there
and they're in the books and I've read
them I've spent 30 years reading in our
tradition and I've seen stuff that
really bothered me but it's there and
and we have to deal with it but does it
represent the ethos or the spirit of
Islam or the spirit of the Prophet I
would argue that it doesn't and so it's
but then there's things that certainly
that happened at the time of the Prophet
that are very troubling for modern
people that's going to be undeniable
concubinage is something that modern
people cannot get their heads around at
all it's very very difficult for people
to grapple with that concept but that
was a prevailing concept not just
amongst Muslims but amongst most of the
civilizations of the of the pre-modern
world so and we certainly have types of
it now it's just criminal activity right
I mean there's probably more concrete
vintage today than at any other time in
human history
just it's not regulated it has no
there's no rights there's no so said I
work from shaken I think um when you
made mention of that mentality of those
that have this you know been to Islam
what maybe even in your opinion or an
approach that we can take now would be
to kind of change that well one of the
things is really interesting to me when
I read Arnold's book on the preaching of
Islam you know he he says that Muslims
were actively engaged in spreading their
religion until the end of the Khilafah
at late 19th century it just stopped
spreading it was very little done and I
just thought that was really interesting
that that Muslims always had
missionaries they were usually came out
of the Sufis I mean even even Tamiya
writes that the the mob today ah amongst
the Sufis did great service by spreading
Islam in places no one else wanted to go
to because they would go like to they
went to the Bogomils I mean Albania
became Muslim over centuries you know
the the Turks arrived there in the in
the 15th century but it took several
hundred years before they really and
there's still the Albania I don't know
they're so very nationalistic as a
people but but it took a long time Egypt
according to a hadith Blankenship who I
trust did not reach 50 percent for the
first 300 years it was mostly Christian
Syria did not reach 50 percent for the
first 500 years and the lúcia never
reached 50 percent there was always a
majority of Christians and so Muslims
have this fantasy that you know the
Muslims just showed up and everybody
said Allah Akbar la la la la it doesn't
work like that they they lived with
these people of different religions and
and they treated them sometimes well and
other times not so well and sometimes
better than other places treated
minorities and sometimes they did
horrible
so they're human and but overall you
know our our our tradition just I think
and the Prophet inculcated this in his
Sahaba he had an incredible tolerance
for for idiosyncrasies and bizarre
behavior and he really tolerated people
as they were and that's why he had some
crazy people around him that are clear
in the Sierra
he had jokesters like no Iman is a clear
jokester and the Prophet tolerated him
you know he went bottom all these gears
and brought him and then the man shows
up and he he said you know you owe me
some money to the Prophet he said why he
said no a man said that you were going
to pay for these yeah you know so and
and he allowed for different the one
thing that he really did not like was
religious extremism really bothered him
probably was very bothered by who do
even in a bat he did not like people to
do excessive better like too much
fasting too much he was very temperate
and moderate dhikr is another thing
doing a lot of Vicker but doing you know
the kind of he said Dada
Benny at FLE slam there's no monkey in
Islam so he was very wary of that he
didn't like extremism but you know when
we were at the conference in Marrakesh
and and the Imam at haramein was there
Abdul Fattah and he's one of the great
moonshee Dean of Morocco got up and sang
he sang and then and then Sam use of got
up and sang well one of the Christian
ladies from the Yvonne Jekyll tradition
she got up and she is burst into song
you know and I saw these Aruna in the
front were kind of like
yeah and I mentioned it later to Shahab
doll and he said honey honey any letter
saying he's just not uptight you know
it's just let people be who they are you
know as long as they're not like harming
or you know so anyway
Salam alaikum Sheikh Hamza can we hop
take one question from online yes here
in the back yeah and this is actually
related to something you just mentioned
but if you have any other remarks or
summary regarding the essence of what
took place in Marrakesh in terms of the
meeting but then he did the Declaration
which you know whereas the conditions in
various parts of the Muslim world have
deteriorated dangerously due to the use
of violence and armed struggle as a tool
for settling conflicts and imposing
one's point of view whereas this
situation has also weakened the
authority of legitimate governments and
enabled criminal groups to issue edicts
attributed to Islam but which in fact
alarmingly distort its fundamental
principles and goals in ways that have
seriously harmed the population as a
whole
whereas this marks the fourteen
hundredth anniversary of the charter of
Medina
a constitutional contract between the
prophet Mohamed Salah TM and the peoples
of Medina which guaranteed the religious
liberty of all regardless of faith
whereas hundreds of Muslim scholars and
intellectuals from over 120 countries
along with represent Islam Akande
international organizations as well as
leaders from diverse religious groups
and nationalities gathered in Marrakesh
on this date to reaffirm the principles
of the Charter and so we declare our
firm commitment to the principles
articulated in the charter of Medina
whose provisions contained a number of
principles of constitutional contractual
citizenship such as freedom of movement
property ownership mutual solidarity and
defense as well as principles of justice
and equality before the law and that the
objectives of the charter of Medina
provide a suitable framework for
national constitutions in countries with
Muslim majorities and the United Nations
Charter and
related documents such as the Universal
Declaration of Human Rights are in
harmony with the Charter of Medina
including consideration for public order
noting further that deep reflection upon
various crises afflicting humanity
underscores the inevitable and urgent
need for cooperation among all religious
groups we affirm hereby that such
cooperation must be based on a common
word requiring that such cooperation
must go beyond mutual tolerance and
respect to providing full protection for
the rights and liberties to all
religious groups in a civilized manner
that issues coercion bias and arrogance
based on all the above we hereby call
upon Muslim scholars and intellectuals
around the world to develop a
jurisprudence of the concept of
citizenship which is inclusive of
diverse groups such jurisprudence shall
be rooted in Islamic tradition and
principles of mindful global changes
urge Muslim educational institutions and
authorities to conduct a courageous
review of educational curricula that
addresses honestly and effectively any
material that instigates aggression and
extremism leads to war and chaos and
results in the destruction of our shared
societies and calling upon politicians
and decision makers to take the
political legal steps necessary to
establish a constitutional contractual
relationship among its citizens and to
support all formulations and initiatives
that aim to fortify relations and
understanding amongst the various
religious groups in the Muslim world we
call upon educated artistic and creative
members of our societies as well as
organizations of civil society to
establish a broad movement for the just
treatment of religious minorities in
Muslim countries and to raise awareness
as to their rights and work together to
ensure the success of these efforts we
call upon the various religious groups
bound by the same national fabric to
address their mutual state of selective
amnesia that blocks memories of
centuries of joint and shared living on
the same land we call upon them to
rebuild the past by reviving this
tradition of conviviality and restoring
our shared trust that has been eroded by
extremists using acts of terror and
aggression we call upon representatives
of the various religions sects and
denominations to confront all forms of
religious bigotry vilification and
denigration of what people hold sacred
as well as all speech that promotes
hatred and bigotry and finally affirm
that it is unconscionable to employ
religion for the purpose of aggressing
upon the
rights of religious minorities in Muslim
countries so that's that's the
declaration and and we had a Yazidi
there hoop yeah you know and he said to
me I spoke to him afterwards and he just
said listen no Benny our community
attributes this to Islam
you know he said we've been living with
Muslims for hundreds of years and the
the sabian said the same thing the Druze
said the same thing yeah so fact the
most painful cry came from the head of
the cities of Iraq you know so but it
was important you know they all shared
their the Christian we had the you know
the Christian Catholic Archbishop we had
the Cardinal sorry Cardinal from the
Catholic tradition with that the bishop
from the Palestinian church you know
also affirming that Muslims have treated
the Christians in in the Holy Lands well
for centuries I'm in a book I recently
read which I found fascinating are the
Syriac sources that really haven't been
looked at this the first time they've
been translated into English but
historically what what people did when
they looked at the Muslim the early
period like Fred Donner they looked at
the Byzantium sources but the Byzantines
were they were they were oppressing a
lot of these religious minorities but
when you look at the actual malachite
church and the Chaldeans and the
Nestorian church and the Jacob white
church and the amount of fissile Church
the stuff they say about Islam is
totally different like they saw them as
liberators and this is the greatest
thing that's happened to this region and
you know it's very different picture
that you get from the Byzantine sources
so anyway I have to go do this interview
so Hanna Columbia Homme de casa donde la
Atlanta stop beautifully like a la
mesilla Odyssey no Mohammed Raja
adios on you send em to Stephen Kajiura
somehow not a bigger of the desert en
masse for no ceremonies in July her
you